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Healers Talk Healing Podcast
The Healers Talk Healing podcast invites you on a transformative journey towards holistic healing, where we explore the mind-body connection, natural remedies, and ancient wisdom to empower you to live a vibrant and balanced life. Join us as we share inspiring stories, expert interviews, and practical tips to help you unlock your true potential and embrace a happier, healthier you.
Healers Talk Healing Podcast
Energetic Congruence: When Your Body and Words Align
What if healing—and selling—weren’t about effort, but about release?
In this episode, we sit down with magnetism strategist Ana Xenia Macko to explore how nervous system regulation, honest communication, and energetic alignment create effortless attraction in both life and business. We unpack why healing is less about forcing forgiveness and more about letting the body release what it’s been holding.
Anna shares discreet, real-time tools you can use anywhere—journaling-and-destroying, gentle self-talk, the butterfly hug, breathwork—to regulate emotions without derailing your day. We also dive into micro-expressions and face reading, revealing how mixed signals quietly sabotage trust, credibility, and sales.
We wrap with a powerful reframe on goals, biology, and presence—why chasing repels, why “you at the top of the pyramid” matters, and how designing your environment supports sustainable success.
If you’re ready to stop chasing and start attracting, press play.
If you're looking for a healing hero OR you are a healing hero and want to be listed on our directory click here to start your journey.
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Welcome to Healers Talk Healing, the podcast where we gather to explore the art and science of holistic healing, uncovering the secrets to a happier, healthier you. I'm your host, Nina Ganguli, and together we will delve into the intriguing world of holistic healing, delving into the mind-body connection, ancient wisdom, and natural remedies. Get ready for enlightening stories, thought-provoking expert interviews, and practical tips that will empower you to unlock your true potential and embrace a vibrant, balanced life. Whether you're an experienced wellness enthusiast or simply curious about the power of healing, join us on this exhilarating journey as we share the wisdom and insights that can truly transform your life. It's time to embark on a voyage towards a happier, healthier you. So, without further ado, let's dive into the captivating world of Healers Talk Healing. Welcome back to Healers Talk Healing, where transformation meets real conversation. Today's guest is nothing short of extraordinary. We're joined by Anna Zanyamako, a magnetism strategist who helps entrepreneurs sell with soul, not scripts. With a decade in mental health counseling and years of running high-profile LA events, Anna NAF uses face reading, energy work, hypnosis, and precision branding to remove hidden blocks and activate the version of you that sells effortlessly in any room or Zoom. In this episode, Anna shares deeply about healing, releasing old stories, and how your nervous system might just be the hidden key to both emotional and business breakthroughs. If you've ever wanted to shift from surviving to thriving, this is your moment. Bring your doubts, leave with power. Let's dive in. Oh my goodness. I am so excited to have Anna Zenia. I hope we I say the middle name correctly, Mako, with us today. It she is so powerful. Um, I'm saying this because I actually know this. I've experienced some of the things that she does. And um, well, I was left in a bit of disbelief and a lot of coughing, Anna. And you can talk about that later during our conversation. But we're so excited to have you here, Lynn and I, on the podcast for Healers Talk Healing. And those of you who listen know that I ask everyone this one question to start the conversation, which is what is your definition of healing?
SPEAKER_03:Letting go. My definition, I've actually, it's funny that you're bringing this question up because the pattern I keep on seeing all across the board is like I got into this with therapy when I was like 10 years old. Then I got into therapy where it was working for me at like 14, 15, and then by the time I was like 19, I was in mindset and all of that. But what I keep seeing is that if the harder that you hold on to the things that hurt you, just the memory of it, the harder it is to move forward. So you can't heal, you're stuck in a vicious cycle. So it's really just about letting go like forgive, let go, whatever it. I don't forgive because I'm like this like higher than thou person. Like I I will hold on to things for a long time. The only reason I let go of them now is because I know that all across the board it's affecting me. So that got me angrier. And I was like, okay, then I'll forgive you.
SPEAKER_02:Yes. When you when you when you realize it's starting to hurt you, then it's like, oh wait, this isn't worth it. This isn't doing anything to the other person, it's doing it to me. So yes.
SPEAKER_01:And that takes something to to step outside and realize that. I think a lot of people have this notion of what forgiveness is, especially when it's such a deep, deep hurt or pain. And holding on to it, I think holding on to it sometimes can be become part of your identity, who you are, how you show up in a space. And then in order to let that part of your identity go, it's very uncomfortable.
SPEAKER_03:When it's not a part of our society's standard to actually like let things go. Like we are, I mean you have to have a moment of acknowledging it, but then you have to move forward. So anything that relates to a victim mindset where it's not my fault, or I can't take responsibility for any part of it, or I can't do anything about it, leads you to staying stuck. And I say that like with I had a lot of things happen to me as a kid, and I shouldn't be saying this, you know what I mean? Um if if anyone has like resentments, it was definitely me. But working in therapeutic services, seeing people getting better, not getting better, seeing the hypnosis work, the energy work, at the end of the day, I still meet with clients that talk about being abused as a kid, and they are well into their 60s and they haven't been able to move forward with certain things. And it's not until they're able to move forward from that that they can actually move forward in their lives. And I did it at like 30 something. I cannot imagine doing that until my 60s. That's that's just so that's what I really think about healing. It's not, I don't think it's everyone's flavor. You really have to see the big picture and you have to want something more for yourself.
SPEAKER_01:I think that's it, is the wanting more for yourself and being willing to do what it takes to get that because we all want more for ourselves. We all, you know, there's lots of people are like, oh, you know, manifestation and abundance and all of that. But then there is there is a deeper or maybe not the the word may not be deeper, but there is action that that also needs to be taken inside of that. And action is not necessarily like movement and walking and doing those things, it's that piece of letting go. And it was one of the things that I struggled with as well when it was when I started realizing that, hey, wait a minute, the person that I'm still I'm upset with and I'm dealing with is no longer in on this planet, so there's nothing I can do, like I can't say, well, you we can I can't have this conversation with you, I can't work it out that way. So I've got to figure out what the letting go means. And I struggled with that for a long time until I got what you said, which is the for me, letting go is the accepting that it's not gonna change. I we I think I'm saying we, because I've spoken to many people where the struggle is accepting that that which happened to you happened to you. Yes, like just like it happened, and there's nothing you can do to change the things that happened. Yeah, you're black and racing. So the best way to move forward, anyways, with my experience is say, okay, it happened. And I that what I struggled with is, but it's not happening now.
SPEAKER_03:So that's why I like the work that I like the hypnosis and the energy work because when I was in therapeutic services, you talk a lot about it and you can compartmentalize what it is that you're saying, but uh there's like an auto zoom, sorry. But you can compartmentalize what it is that you're saying, but it's hard to feel that inside. So there's like what I've seen is with the hypno work and the energy work, the body is releasing it, so it's not just about your conscious beliefs and how you feel about it, your body experienced that. So you have to have, and that's why you have to acknowledge it and then move forward, hold that space and then let it go because your body has been screaming for, and this is generally speaking, like my body had been literally crying out and screaming for me to allow me to feel my feelings without reservation and without condemnation. Yes, yes, that it and it's a moment, it's a most people don't even realize that they're doing it, but you get a moment of weakness, you get a moment of being vulnerable and you're hurt for whatever reason, and it's like I have to do things, I have to work, I have to like you kind of push it to the back of your mind, and then you don't allow yourself to feel the feelings until you're all alone at night or something. And this is really common, but the trick of actually getting through it is when they come up, allowing yourself to give yourself that space and understand, like, oh, I'm humaning right now. This feeling is human, and I'm sorry that this happened to me in this way. My my body's literally reacting. Um, but it it and so the body is like your child self when they talk about your um different versions of yourself. It's the child that never got hugged. It's the child that never was told it's okay, it's not your fault. So when we have these feelings and we condemn ourselves, that child throws a temper tantrum and it doesn't want to let go. So if I do it the opposite, where I'm like, I love you. A lot of times, like if I hit a new level or something crazy happens, I'm like, this means I'm alive. This means I'm alive, I'm enough, everything's okay, and it calms, it's calming down again. Like it it you can feel it. So it's not just a decision, but it's also your body is kind of like a marker or a ruler compass that's guiding you, trying to tell you, hey, we need to feel this, give us the space. And until you do it, like it's gonna be tooth and nail to actually let go of things.
SPEAKER_02:So, how would you what would you suggest in terms of energy, emotions, whatever it is, the even reliving an experience at what appears to be an inopportune time because you're sitting at work behind the desk, the boss comes up, and all you want to do is just scream, cry, or whatever in that moment because of what's coming up. Uh, I actually have a friend like that, it's a male, by the way. He cries at the drop of the hat. And so what would you suggest that a person can do when it feels like the the most appropriate thing to do would be stuff it, but stuffing it is not really the answer in that moment.
SPEAKER_03:Writing is number one because uh words are spells, and so when we learn to write, when we learn to speak, we actually are manifesting things all everyone's manifesting what they want all of the time. It's not like, oh, if I do this, like you can start to have control over what you're manifesting, but it we're always doing it. So if a person is feeling that way, whether it's anxiety, sadness, what what is happening is that your body is overwhelmed like a computer system and it needs a release. So writing is number one. If you can just write out how you feel and either burn it, drown it, tear it up, you are quite literally taking those emotions from out of your body, giving it the space to express itself fully, and then destroying it as no longer a valid real thing in your mindset anymore or your body or whatever. Um, so that's one, and also the self-soothing that's baby talk. I have a lot of clients, and like one of the first things that I have people start doing is baby talk, and they're like, what? And I'm like, it works like a charm all the time. If you I just did it to myself three times, and every time my body, my left, my left leg, the muscles spasmed and it moved, and then when I did it the second time, my heart felt warm, like it was like even now, it's like if I was petting, I imagine this is what it feels like to be pet as an animal, but your it's really understanding that your body is its own entity, your spirit and your feelings and your thoughts are another entity, and so what's happening is your body needs that release, or your heart needs that release, or your spirit, whichever one. But writing, self-soothing, giving yourself baby talk, and then uh number three, there were a bunch of I can't remember where this was, but there were a bunch of children that their parents had been um that passed away, and it was an orphanage filled, and the therapists that were interning there, there weren't enough therapists to hug the kids. And so they developed a strategy, this is a long time ago, of like the butterfly or the self-hug. That is another form of self-soothing that is it just does wonders. So, even with those three, if you actually practice those three, you don't have to sit down and meditate because when you're feeling like that, it's hard to get in the mindset and like in the zone and like ground and all of that. Um, it really comes down to understanding that it's a computer system, your body, and it needs that release. So, those are three ways that you can give it that release that give you the privacy still in that kind of environment to not end up because it's worse too. It starts snowballing when then it's starting affecting work, and then it's starting to affect this, and then it's like, oh god, I have no control over things. But the moment that you take back that control or the illusion of is when you take back the reins, and then you get to decide what it is that you want. Like, there was one job where uh it was in mental health, and like I could easily say when things were happening, when I was sad, when I needed a moment, when I needed to go regulate my it was awesome. But then I've had other jobs or businesses, especially when I was doing my marketing where I didn't have that luxury. And we're still in a society where it's like this is the human experience, it's not the spiritual experience. You get a spiritual experience because we're already spirit, so the human experience is doing this weird stuff in business and like showing up when you're not convertible. Um does that make sense?
SPEAKER_02:It does, and it's interesting when you were saying that when you said the third one was a hug, I envisioned a person being at their desk and their feelings, someone coming up, and most times people cross their arms, but instead of crossing your arms, it might be, you know, just something like this. It it's the hug, but it can be subtle, it doesn't have to be for a long time, but it it can still allow, as you said, the the feelings to be expressed and the the soothing, the the calming. Um I've seen that a lot. In that moment, in in that in that moment, you know, in that moment.
SPEAKER_03:But the thing you just reminded me of too is the breathing.
SPEAKER_02:Yes, and breathing.
SPEAKER_03:I forgot about that part. It's like you have like that's probably the easiest one where it's just you have to do it slow of one, two, three, four, in, hold for, release for, just a practice. God, there's so many cool things now.
SPEAKER_01:Yes, yes, I think it's important for people to remember it's a practice because at first it can it feels it can feel uncomfortable because it's um unfamiliar, you know, it's not the first thing you're gonna think about is self-soothing and doing the baby talk and you know, even breathing, like it's just the breathing in a way that's gonna work for you because I know that I know these things, everything that you're saying, except for the baby talk, I know about. And so, but to remember it in the moment where you need to release it, that's that's the practice. And I want to say that for the listeners and those those who are watching, because we're practiced ladies on here who who have a lot of tools and use a lot of tools, but it's practice, it's practice in those moments. A friend of mine, she's uh seeing a therapist, and one of the things she said to her therapist was, I have all the tools, but when the time comes to, you know, like I'm losing my crap, and all uh you're not thinking about tools at that time. You know, and the what the therapist said, which I I agree with, is yes, you in those immediate moments, you're not gonna use your tools. Your humanness is just gonna human, you're gonna be a human and things are gonna happen, but somebody who is practiced enough knows, hey, oh, I have a toolbox. Oh, now I can like I've done something, now I can breathe, now I can hug myself, now I can do those things. Whereas someone who's learning, we've you know, I think that's the piece of talking to those listeners who are just learning, just walking in to give themselves a bit of space to say, hey, you're this is just something new. If once you're once your amygdala calms down, and you can you can take that moment to like, oh yeah, what did Anna say? What did Lynn say? Right, I can breathe. No one is noticing that I'm having a meltdown. I'm just gonna take a minute to breathe. And you know, I I wanted to impart that because a lot of people I know will listen, because I have people in my life like, oh, easy for you. No, no, it's not easy for me.
SPEAKER_02:No, it's not easy for anyone, but as you said, practice is important. It's no different than um, you know, if you go to the gym and you're doing a specific type of exercise or something to build a certain part of the body, you're it's you're it's something you have to consistently do. And so these are are things that you know, everything you suggested, Anna, is so on point. And that's whether you're by yourself or whether you're standing in line at the grocery store, you can always think, oh, let me take a breath, you know, for a count of four, an exhale. And it doesn't have to be a super deep breath, but people wouldn't necessarily notice. You're just releasing. It can be the you know, standing kind of like this, you know, and I've seen people do this. I mean, they just naturally will stand this way.
SPEAKER_03:Or it's you know it's funny because what I'm remembering is when I was in my 20s, it was like the thing to do was like practice kegels. And oh yes. So to me, it's the same concept. You have to, but it's a practice where it's like no one knows what you're doing when you're doing it, but it's there. It's there. It's But I love that analogy too. That of that's why I'm like, oh yeah, it's a muscle work.
SPEAKER_02:Muscle work.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Without it in your own private little space, no matter who's around or not. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. That's a gift, I think, for the for those who are listening. It's a gift to know that you can uh manage yourself and your body at any given time. It doesn't have to be as dramatic as you think, like, oh, I need a moment to hold on. I need to walk away. And well, yeah, you some people do need to walk away. But I'm saying you don't have to have that big dramatic pause. It literally could be okay. So someone is in my space and it's it's affecting me, and I can, you know, do my kegels and they're never gonna know what's going on. I know that the first thing I do in order when I begin to ground myself is I have this, uh it's a I know it's a trauma response, but I I use it to my advantage, was my which is my doe face. I'm just like, okay. And then in my mind, I'm like, calm down. And I'm looking at you like this, and inside I'm like, I want to punch you. I want to punch you in the face right now.
SPEAKER_02:So you so you've practiced your doe face, isn't it? Yes.
SPEAKER_01:When I was young, I would get in a lot of trouble. So the best thing to do is just like it's a freeze response, but that freeze response now works to my advantage where I'm in that space. And and unless you know me very well, the minute you see the doe face, um, when you know me, you'll know, okay, she's not saying what she really means. Like exactly not saying what I mean, but if you don't know me, you think I'm listening actively and intently. Now I gave one my secret, now everyone's gonna know. But the thing is, it um it's helped a lot. Otherwise, the things that actually go on in here, if they came out, or I actually might, you know, no one has ever said to me, Nina, you gotta fix your face, because my face doesn't always give it away unless you know me really well. And so then when you do see me, you know me really well, I will get someone who says, Um, okay, what's actually going on? I can totally that you just went into like double face mode.
SPEAKER_02:I love that. Yes, yes. It is, it's it's it's excellent. Um I think everything that's that's being shared is great for people to remember. Uh there's there is the connection between spirit, body, mind, uh, emotions. And so doing what works best, you know, for you is always the key. Uh, I was speaking to someone this weekend who really has gone through actually an extremely, extremely traumatic situation that's lasted over this past year. And in speaking with her, um, I spoke to her, her, spoke to her about release. I said, Well, does meditation help you release? Grounding, she said, Well, not really. I said, Does journaling or writing help you release? And she goes, No. And then I said, Does buying 99 cent plates at the dollar store and breaking them help you release? And she said, Yes. I said, Does screaming help you release? She said, Yes. I said, okay. I said, so this is what we'll do. We will go to the beach, you know, because we're both in LA. We'll go to the beach. I said, and you can break the 99. Well, they're not 99 cents anymore, they're$1.25. But anyway, well, break the dollar 25 dishes. You can do that. I said, I'm gonna sit on the side and have my sandwiches and so forth. And anybody walking by, I'll just tell them that you're an actress practicing for your part. Don't don't get involved with your process and you scream as much as you need, you do whatever you need to release and to get it out. And I said, being the nice thing about being in in Hollywood and around it, nobody will question that. But you know, everyone releases differently, and so I think it's important for people to um acknowledge what works for them because Anna, you're absolutely right. The release is significant, and then with the release, the soothing, the comforting is just as significant, they go hand in hand, and it's it's so important for people to be able to move forward, I think, that way in the process of healing. So tell us a little bit more, Anna, about what you do and what your process is in terms of healing or helping people to heal.
SPEAKER_03:So it's funny because I primarily do sales and sales training. Well, sales can be healing. It is, and that's the funniest thing. When I was working in mental health, I saw a lot of people not getting better for a long time. And it wasn't until I shifted where I realized like, if you're in mental health, you're trying to get better, but that's like the first starting point. Once you get more under your belt, the things that used to hold you back aren't really harmful, and now you're looking at how can I gain something out of what I'm doing. So I actually have uh three of the main modalities that I use um face reading, micro-expression, face reading and micro-expression is one. So I can read your face and then uh give you an analysis, but I can also align you to what matches you. Um so I can see like couples when they match, when they don't match, employees and employee, like all of it. But the oh, and this is the cool part. When people are doing sales or presentations, they give out micro expressions. And so I will work with a person, find their microexpressions, and we'll uncover why that's coming out. When we uncover why that's coming out, I usually get to the root cause of it, whether it's something in their childhood, a faulty belief system, whatever it is, we find it, pinpoint it, and then we'll do energy work on it to either remove it and release it, or we will do hypnosis to give an entire upgrade, if you will. Um and I studied the I do fascia release manipulation, like I can move the whole meat suit. I call it a meat suit. But there's no other way. I've I've been saying it for years, and then when I actually work on someone, they're like, wow, you really did move my meat suit. Yes, it just moves. But the energy work and the hypnosis I have found really I can see when the body releases it if we're doing hypno or we're doing energy work. It's not just, oh, do you feel better? Like I can see the shift in the facial structure where they release, and then when they do the pre the same presentation, that micro expression doesn't come out anymore.
SPEAKER_01:It's gotta make sense. Can I ask something? Like, what is a micro expression? What does that mean?
SPEAKER_03:Um so like I when if I go on a date and the guy is nervous and he's smiling, but then he's like he has a little spasm. Okay, it's really just pent-up emotion that needs a release and doesn't have one, and that comes out as a micro expression. So if you are sad, a lot of times people uh will have a smile, but their eyes are very like sad. That's a micro expression. Um, in sales, like one of the ones that I give to people is if you're having a conversation with someone and their pupils dilate, like they're in love, that's a yes. Now you just want to get them to keep saying yes so that they get to a point where they're like, now that's another micro expression. Yes, maybe this. Or when we're like, I don't like people, like those are micro, my hand gestures explaining it, these are micro expressions, and what happens a lot of times is if a person is not aligned, so let's say um I don't have a seven-figure business yet, but let's say I was trying to say that I did. Uh the micro expressions that would be coming out with me saying, I have and run a seven-figure business. You see how like my head turned?
SPEAKER_01:Oh, yes, because your head's like, no, you don't. Yes.
SPEAKER_03:You're constantly telling people the truth because it's 55 to 77% of communication is nonverbal. That means micro expressions, hand gestures, voice tonality, um, there's some auditory things, and there's also a vibration, like an actual scientific frequency that you give off. Some of the best people that like the best people at sales that I've ever seen have uh very black hat energy where they know how to it's not just micro expressions coming out, it's also what you're putting out. So when you see a house cat or any kind of cat in the wild get a a prey, they actually have a sound wave, it's a frequency that goes to the prey, and the cat goes because it's yeah, it's sending the frequency to the prey so that the nervous system of the prey relaxes and the cat is able to kill it or unalive it with ease, comfort, if you will. It's like less strength quick. Yeah, it's very quick. Um, and people in sales that are really good at that and understand that ability that we as humans have to do the same thing, they can sit there and energetically have the person feel at ease. Relaxed. I'm holding space for you so that you start reeling in here. So the micro expressions and the are really both of those because you can see them too. When a person is doing that and they have that ability, they are much more relaxed, but also into the conversation so you feel really seen, heard, understood. And I mean, most people want to feel understood, heard, and seen. Of course, of course.
SPEAKER_02:I think everyone does, yes, yes, that's very true. It's interesting you were speaking about the micro expression. The the one that I recognize most is the one where someone says, Oh, I just absolutely love this house. You know, they're they they say one thing and their body is completely telling you the opposite.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Take note of that now. This person's actually saying this. When they're trying to say this.
SPEAKER_03:One of the things when I make a purchase, whether it's a coaching program or whatever it is, if the person is not matching, I don't buy from them. And it may just be that they're having an off day or they're thinking about something else, but that you're either pushing a sale away or you're bringing it in. There's just two options. And when you are not aware of, and forget about that, like I know a lot of people that are single not by choice, because they don't realize that they're doing the same thing that a person in sales that doesn't sell anything does, which is, and this is really important for mindset. Um, what you think about and feel is gonna be what manifests. The whole purpose of us having the human experience is for each of us to have the human experience. And a lot of times what women do, and men, but um mainly I've seen women and men, whatever, they get so excited about something they're infatuated, it's all that they think about. When you do that, you're pushing it away energetically. That's what's happening on a frequency energetic aura level. Like this is proven with science on a molecular level, they were able to see that your auric field becomes really potent and it expands. And when it expands and you don't know how to hold space for people, you push people away. And so you'll have someone that's really excited, like a little puppy dog wanting someone to pay attention, going to this group, going to this group, going to this one, and everywhere they go, there's like chaos. Or like a girl or a guy that gets broken up with all of the time, or um like you really want this kind of career path, but it's not working out. Most of the time, from what I've seen, it has to do with the fact that you get so excited as a person, you start thinking about it. So let's say this is my boyfriend. Well, a date. We're gonna say this is my date, and we're gonna call him. Give me a name.
SPEAKER_04:Bob.
SPEAKER_03:Bob just came to it. Bob, there you go, Bob.
SPEAKER_02:A frag or whatever. Yeah, Bob.
SPEAKER_03:Bob is amazing. We've been going out for a couple weeks. We he's like super everything that I wanted on my list. And so now I'm starting to think about Bob when I'm here at the podcast. Talking to you guys, I will think about Bob. Yes. When I am, no, I want this. Um, when I am making something like work, like creating a funnel, and I'm thinking about Bob, I'm taking away from the thing that I'm doing. So the more that you're thinking and feeling about other people more than you're thinking and feeling about yourself, that's where the off-kilter happens.
SPEAKER_01:Oh, fascinating.
SPEAKER_02:That's very that's very great information. Yeah, that's good to know. Yeah, and I see it's not being present either. Yeah, you know, what you're talking about is not being present. Your your physical body may be doing one thing, but your thoughts, your energy, your attention is completely somewhere else.
SPEAKER_00:It's not me.
SPEAKER_02:And it's not with you. So I like the way you express that. You know, when you're when you are uh thinking about yourself, in other words, when you're being present with yourself and what you're doing rather than thinking about Bob, even though it might be pleasant to think about Bob, but you know, right now you're doing this.
SPEAKER_03:You can think about Bob in the shower, exactly. You can think about Bob, but you want to have the mathematical equation. Am I thinking about Bob's really what it comes down to? Am I thinking about Bob even 60% more than I'm thinking about me and everything else? That's the issue. And so when someone and it's it's human, like we're not told this, so it's something that I studied for a long time because I'm I had it, and it was like not with like Bob's and stuff, because that's a different animal, but with business, I really wanted to have for as much as I've done, I should have already had a million multi-million dollar company. But the issue that I had was that I wanted it so bad that I forgot about taking care of myself. I forgot about uh taking care of my house, taking care of my cats, taking care of my family, like having constant relationships. Life became so this is the top of the pyramid. Life itself went below getting that seven multi-seven figure business. So, yes, I was thinking about it the most, but I am supposed to be at the top of the pyramid. Life, me, the actual living part is supposed to be at the top, and then that business part over here, and then Bob over here, and then family over here. But that life part, if I'm not going out on walks, I'm not meditating, I'm not reinvesting in myself somehow and putting me as a priority, that's when everything else you get, you you need, you end up feeling like you need something outside of yourself to be good enough, to feel loved, to feel worthy, to feel uh accepted. And so, really, all it comes down to is am I thinking and feeling about myself first and then everything else, and then you're gonna see the actual changes happen in your life.
SPEAKER_02:That makes so much sense. And it takes a lot of this. I also want to make the comment because some people feel that to do that is selfish, and it's actually the opposite of selfishness. Yeah, it's the it's it's selflessness, well, or self, it's not being self-absorbed, it's just self-nurturing, self-care, self-love because from that place and the cliche, your cup is full, and then you're able to extend that to others.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, and I try and tell people it's like it's really this I like facts and science to like back it up so that I can it's what helped me make more impact in others and myself. I first started it all with myself, right? Because I'm selfish. Um but I learned it's a nervous system thing. So if I have anything at the top of the pyramid that's not me first, my nervous system gets out of whack and it starts grasping for things to make me feel better. But if I put my nerve, I mean, yeah, that's if it's not at the top, but if I put it at the top, my nervous system is calm. I can talk to myself about how I feel, which makes me more pleasant to be around, which makes people around me feel more welcomed and at ease as well. So I can end up either being the storm if I'm not taking care of my nervous system first, or I can be the calamity in the storm where other people come to me and just by being around me, they feel calmer. That's really what it comes down to, but it's the nervous system. So it can't be selfishness unless you're saying me, me, me, me, me, and and no food and no friends, and no family and no word. Like then you're getting into some other territory.
SPEAKER_02:Yes, that's a whole nother story and a different diagnosis.
SPEAKER_01:It's funny this conversation is bringing to mind um two things. Something that you said, Lynn, about being present when we were in that conversation about presence, and I was Going back to the example of going to the gym, and a lot of times a trainer or coach will say you need that bond that mind muscle connection. So you have to be so present that when you are doing that exercise, whatever it is, let's just say it's a squat, and you're connecting with your body, you're envisioning your muscles and making sure that you're connecting to your body in a way that makes it more effective. And what I'm hearing in what we're sharing is that there is a presence, but also a presence for self. And that presence for self is something that we as a society, I'm gonna say as a whole, we're not taught. We're taught about, you know, what are you going to give to others? Who are you going to be for others? Not who are you for yourself. I think if we started there, like who are you for yourself? Um it would be simpler. I'm not gonna say it's gonna be easier, but it would be simpler.
SPEAKER_03:Well, I agree because the whole thing that got me into this was narcissists and empaths. They're everyone everyone thinks that if you're an empath, that's a good thing because you feel no, you're both terrible. You're both have nervous systems that have put every their nervous systems, both of them are crash outs because one nervous system cut everything out and can't connect or feel anything else, so it's constantly grasping for things because it's not at the top of the period, it doesn't even know how it only knows how to suck the life out of everything else, but then the other one doesn't know how to put the itself at the pyramid because everyone and everything is at the top. They feel everyone else's feelings except for their own. Both end up being storms. One might be more purposeful, but they still end up being storms. So when I looked at it that way, I was like, well, damn, there really is no wrong or right. It just what is what am I doing as my part in humanity, is what it comes down to. Am I gonna be a storm of a nervous system or am I going to be a calamity of a nervous system? And I think it's also important if you have examples of that. Because I like it's not like I had I was born and raised in LA and two, but it's people like crazy, you know what I mean? And so to find those people that are like the calamity in the storm, I really had to find them, but they wowed me every time. They wowed me on their patience, they wowed me on their uh contentment, they wowed me in how they held space for people without even trying. It was always extra. And then I got to see these people and how much impact they had over the course of years versus an empath or even narcissists that is there's a lot that are in the industry that I'm in, and I can see it because they're like micro expressions or telling me something different, but they are equally good if as if not better at times than the empath or anybody else to get into the psychological of how do I shift this person. That's one another fascinating thing. I'm like, one of the one of the um hypnosis things that I do, I learned from a man that was a narcissist, and he was very like vocal about how he lived and that it's like a pattern disruptor that he has to constantly go through. But he had one of the most powerful to this day hypnosis sessions that I ever received and that I learned from. So, right? It's like okay.
SPEAKER_02:The rest of the conversation wasn't very good, but that part was like that part was amazing, right? The part that you really wanted to garner and receive, right? Yeah, got it. Which which made it which made it the right thing, you know, it was it was good in that in in that moment in time, and he delivered what he needed to, regardless of his um narcissistic tendencies.
SPEAKER_03:But if I had been in the predisposition to judge the human that he was before, uh-huh, I wouldn't have gone with him. I mean, it give me like five years ago, I wouldn't have gone with him. I would have felt his energy, seen him, and I would have been like, knowing what I know now, I'm like, oh, let's see what you got. Because I'm not, I have myself at the top of the pyramid. So when someone tries to do anything, I'm just like, here we go. And like the funny thing is, they're always looking for a reaction from you. And so I'm like, I have no reactions. I'm just like, oh, that's what my if anything, my reaction is like, oh, that's what you're doing. Okay, next.
SPEAKER_02:And there are all your micro expressions right there.
SPEAKER_01:I think it's so powerful to understand the superpower that you have when you can understand when you put yourself at the top of the pyramid, and also understand that. So that's the first time I've heard that you know, a narcissist, or maybe it's the second time, I think you told us that before when we were having a conversation, that there's the they're they're just like the same but a different side of the coin, the narcissist and the empath, and how they're trying to fill things up outside of themselves. And when you are filling up yourself, and we hear it all the time, and it is a constant I'm gonna say struggle because that's what it is for me. Um I can't say it's a struggle for everybody else, uh, because I'm so wired in that opposite way and to create those those that new sense like I I try every day to think about okay, what does Nina want first when I with my eyes open? But it is it is interesting as I'm saying this to you that that's not the first thought that always comes into mind. What does the dog need? What does my husband need? Okay, what do I need to do for them so then I can do what I need to do for myself? That's the way I think.
SPEAKER_03:Right.
SPEAKER_02:Right.
SPEAKER_01:Go ahead.
SPEAKER_02:No, I was just gonna say that's part of the the training and the program societally, globally, in different ways, that we've all accepted as the way to live, the way to get along, the way to be accepted, the way for, you know, that we're supposed to be. So shifting that mindset, as Anna's talking about, is uh can feel like you're walking, you're what you're really walking toward the sun when you shift your mindset in terms of being at the top of the pyramid while everyone else is walking away from the sun and they're like, hey, you're going the wrong direction. And you're like, no, really, the the warmth, it's it's over there, you know. And so, yes, that's why it can feel like a struggle because you're you're pushing up against and you're moving up against and um what has been taught, what becomes per what has been perpetuated and and so forth in that belief system. And so, and then even when everyone's removed, whoever may have had influence over you throughout your life, they're not, you know, with you at certain times or what have you, you hear their voices, you hear the situations, you you you tell yourself the same things, and you still feel like you're, you know, you have to struggle with that.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, and the thing resentment gets built up either way, right? Because I get mad that I'm thinking about it, because I know I should be putting myself first. This is what happens. Nina, stop, hold on. What do you need? What do you need to do? What do you need to do? What would you like to do? And it's still tough because sometimes I don't even have the answer to that question.
SPEAKER_03:Well, then that just means I mean, can I speak frankly?
SPEAKER_01:Of course you can.
SPEAKER_03:Um, that then that means that you're not putting yourself at the top at all because if part of the learning process, and this is good for people to hear, is you get to a point where you've given so much to everyone and everything else that you can't even hear your body tell you what it needs anymore.
SPEAKER_01:I would agree with that. I was just thinking ding ding ding until it gets too late, where it's so pathistic and it's like, oh, it's screaming so loudly you can't ignore it anymore.
SPEAKER_03:Well, that's how people get sick. I mean, I was just talking to another friend that his mother passed away brutally from cancer. I mean, uh anomalies were happening where like a simple surgery turned into a major complication and it just was snowballing after that. But if you took a look at the rest of her life, it was an entire struggle the whole time. Every I mean, it was when we were talking about it, I'm like, no offense, but like I can see why she didn't want to persevere, and she didn't like for what? It really like and a part of the thing that makes it easier to want to change is really simple. It's just creating a life worth living, a life where you are like, Yes, I like what I do, I like who I'm with, I like who I am, I enjoy my time, I am I make time to have fun, I eat good food, I drink good drinks. Like, I'm into spiritualism, but I still drink alcohol. And I'm like, when I go get drunk with a friend, they're usually clients, like some of the clients you know, and and so if they're like older than me, so it's not like I'm going out with people my age, but they can drink more than me.
SPEAKER_02:They can drink more than anybody, actually.
SPEAKER_03:And but it has to do with like I'm waking up all the time saying, like, I love my life, I love, I got a new comforter. And this is like it's so important. So I would advise you to learn about your the nervous system, how it reacts to things, because what happens is it basically like tightens and then it's hard to relax again. Um but when you learn about oxytocin and dopamine, dopamine is the push through, persevere, I reached this goal, I did this. That's mainly a man's nervous system, a woman's nervous system. So if you have a uterus that you were born with, that usually is oxytocin based.
unknown:Okay.
SPEAKER_03:So most of the work, I have the discipline to get things done, but like I have everyone's always like, wow, you have long nails. Like they're pretty, like they're not, they're long. But when I'm, and usually this is like kind of basic because usually they have sparkles, they have diamonds, they're like encrusted because when I'm typing and I get bored, I look at my nails and I've trained myself to say, oxytocin, I love this, and then I keep going. I just got a new comforter and it's like a beautiful flower print. So now every morning I'm waking up and I'm like, I love this bed. I love making my bed, I love my chandelier. This is oxytocin that I'm making my body completely aware of, and it makes everything super easy. It calms down my nervous system so that I can do things easily. So when you wake up in the morning, I wouldn't think what do I need or what do they need. I would do a gratitude list. Like, number one is a gratitude list because that's gonna give you the oxytocin to relax enough so that you can actually ask yourself, okay, now what do I want? Because the oxytocin is going to literally give you the happy, like I love life drug in your body, so that you're like, Oh, I know what I want. I wanted milk. I never drink milk, I literally never drink milk. But before the podcast today, I was like, I really my body wants milk, so we're gonna drink milk. And I it was delicious, but it's oxytocin, so oxytocin for women, dopamine for men. Men, if they do yes, gratitude list gives them in a higher frequency, but then it's like, okay, now not what do I want, it's what do I want to do for men. For women, it's what's gonna make me happy right now.
SPEAKER_01:That's just fantastic because it's not that I haven't heard gratitude is important, of course. I've heard that, and I do don't do it every day when I am feeling like okay, what's going on with you? Just being gratitude for a moment. You're right, it does change things, but I never thought about it that way as a tool to get closer to that. I'm gonna say this because now this is a visual visual for me, and I'm a visual person, I'm always gonna do the triangle and being in the triangle and starting there, that's easy. Like it's easier than dealing with okay, what do I need to get done? So, what do I need to do for them so that I can do for me? And then what is it that I need to do for me?
SPEAKER_03:But that's all dopamine and masculine.
SPEAKER_01:I'm not surprised.
SPEAKER_03:So I'm very connected to my masculinity. Well, that's that's most of society. It's not a thing that makes you different. Like that's how I was more like maybe even still five years ago. But it's a practice where when I discovered the stuff about the nervous system and oxytocin and dopamine, I was like, I love cheat codes. I don't like working hard. So I figured out really quickly by um, and again, like I was okay, so I was in therapeutic services for 10 years. I had marketing and business development for five years, and then I got into this for overlapping for 10 years. Um I have a wealth of knowledge that allows me to get cheat codes for people so that they don't have to talk for a long time and figure things out. Like I had a guy get a back brace, and within three months he was able to sell finally after not selling for three years. The oxytocin is the cheat code for women because our society, there's a woman that wrote a book and it did the discovery that all of the studies that they do on um like the test dummies that they use in car crashes for a man, it's literally a man's body, a man's weight, a man's structure, a man's bone structure, density, everything. Oh, you're muted, Lynn. Um, but they're all of I mean everything. You go to the airport, you go to the bathroom, you go to the the things that have to do with safety, like the seat belts, they were created for men. This entire world was created for men. You have to set goals, you have to do this. Like when I had the marketing agency, I was making money, I was doing things, but I was doing it like a man, like, oh, I have to do business. I can't, it was exhausting and I got depleted. I for women to work off of like to be able to work because we're in the society where we have to work sometimes. Oxytocin is the key. And I I saw this because I would see girls that weren't working as hard as I did, that were making more money with ease and still having lives. And I'm like, how the hell are they doing it? Turns out it was oxytocin.
SPEAKER_02:But you know, this whole thing makes so much sense to me because the the way that I, you know, design decorate and design my house and so forth, when I wake up in the morning, I I like you, I look at my bedspread and I'm like, wow, I really love this. I love art and beauty. And so as when I'm surrounded with art and beauty and everything has a beautiful balance to it, and you know, the different shapes and and colors that are easy. It's I I do often wake up and go, oh, I just really love this. I'm so grateful that my living room looks this way. I'm so grateful for all the flowers. I'm grateful for, you know, and I never thought about the fact where my husband is completely the opposite and his his spaces are very um, let's just say not the tidiest, the neatest, the organ, most organized, so on and so forth. And I have a visceral effect where I almost don't even want to walk into those spaces because it upsets me. So thank you for sharing that. That's that's huge.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, that's a beautiful gift to to walk away with for the both men and women who are listening in today to know that where you can begin to develop this space for yourself first and how to do that. That's that's always a question, right? The question, well, how? Well, how do I do that? And yet it's it's simple and it's it's good to understand. And it was funny when you were talking about how things were designed for men. I remember when I was working in the corporate world, I have carpal tunnel syndrome. And you know, basically the ergonomic or the person who does the ergonomic assessment, I don't know what they're called. The person who did the assessment said that desks are built for men. The average desk size is for a man who's like five, seven, five, eight, and I'm five, two. So the desk is one. Yeah, the desk is not designed. Uh I'm literally sitting on two cushions so that that I have the proper the proper height for for my couple tunnels undermat home because I'm also working on the computer at home all the time. And I think we need to kind of remember that for us. Um, I'm gonna say us women, because it's three women having this conversation. And the majority of our listeners and our and the people that we connect with are women on this on this discovery, is that to f to come to a space where we can really connect or reconnect to our femininity and what works for us, and have that conversation inside of even the healing conversation, right? And I can hear it from my husband, who, when I'm talking to a friend of mine, male, he's a healer. So he has a different energy. You can see that his energy is more balanced, and you know, he's good friends with my husband, and my husband's always poking a little fun at him because of that side of him that's more feminine, I guess, and more connected to the femininity. And I think it's interesting. Um, I mean we could have a whole nother conversation about this and a whole nother podcast. But what I want to get back to is just for us to remember to design our lives for a way that works for us, built on our superpowers as the feminine, as the woman, all you know, women, people with uteruses, they have this, as you said, right? So it's important for us to remember that it's even inside of our healing journeys that we're gonna heal differently as well. And the tools are from this conversation I'm gathering, probably the tools will be different as well.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, it I do like to harp on like, well, sort of. I think the tools are eerily similar. It's just figuring out what works for you, like Lynn said. So when I talk about oxytocin and I talked about my nails, that's for me. I had a best friend, she hated nails and she would never get them done like that. And she hated them so much she would like chop them down to ever like you would never see them long on her. So that would not work on her. But she could get uh oxytocin from maybe doing her hair or maybe going for a walk. Doing that gratitude list, uh looking at family pictures. It just depends on what you really we're supposed to have the human experience. So, like sometimes I wear pink, sometimes I hate everyone, and I like think I'm a rebel and I'm wearing all black. It just depends on my mood. And that's the other thing with women. If you look at men's hormones, they're straight like spaghetti, and women's hormones are wet spaghetti, they're intertwined and connected. That's why everything means something. That being said, allowing ourselves to understand that we are not one set person and that there are different versions within each of us is the biggest gift that I think any woman can acknowledge for herself. Because, like I said, today I'm wearing pink and I'm bubbly. Literally, last week there was like black and red, pretty much.
SPEAKER_01:And so talk to me hour to hour, minute to minute. One I can love my husband, and the next minute he's breathing the wrong way, and it's irritating. Exactly.
SPEAKER_03:But it's it's that gift of of having those hormones. So, and some women have uh more straight hormones and less spaghetti hormones, and some men have more spaghetti hormones and less straight hormones. So it's it's important to understand just where you fit for yourself because you want to wake up like I love my life.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, you just I mean, isn't that that the end, not even the end game? That's the the point of the game, is that's the point is to love it. And I think that's the best place for us to kind of end our conversation because I think we could go on for another hour um or two. Easily, easily, yeah.
SPEAKER_03:And this is just so wonderful, Anna. That means you're gonna have me back.
SPEAKER_02:Absolutely, of course.
SPEAKER_00:You can come back anytime. Absolutely. No, should I say, of course you can.
SPEAKER_01:No, if you're listening and you couldn't see what I'm saying, of course you can, and nodding my head, no, but you know, in jest. Yes, it's been a powerful conversation. And those of you who are interested in connecting with Anna more and reaching out to her for support in everything that she spoke about, because I have had I've been very blessed. We've had Anna come and work with the team, and I got some like direct stuff, which Anna has helped me so much. Thank you so much on a personal level. I'm still like that's pretty powerful. Um you can find her on our directory if you go to miraclesdirectory.com and you will type in her name, you will find her information there and connect with her. That way, we are so exactly excited to have you here. And you can come back anytime. Anytime.
SPEAKER_02:Yes, and we will and we will be having you back, not only for this, but other things too. So uh for those of you that that again want to know more about Anna, by all means go to the directory, contact her, let her know how much you uh enjoy everything she's shared, and find out what she can maybe help, you know, make happen for you too. So thank you so much, so much, Anna. And I do want to say from our team session, everyone has received incredible results, even those who are um more analytical, if you will, and not necessarily into some of these aspects where like, wow, that was a powerful session. Oh yeah, she's good. So I wanted to share that with you and thank you. See oxytocin!
SPEAKER_03:Oxytocin.
SPEAKER_01:Oxytocin. This is my oxytocin as becoming for me. These are simple ones.
SPEAKER_03:We we just had a big whole love fest today. So I'm very, very grateful. I think this is a great way for me to have a middle of my day. Um, and I will just keep bugging you guys because I just adore the both of you. And it is so thank you.
SPEAKER_02:Right back at you. We adore you too. Yes, thank you so, so much, so much.
SPEAKER_01:Until next time, everyone. Bye for now. Thank you for joining us today on Healers Talk Healing. We hope you've been inspired and empowered on your holistic healing journey. If you've enjoyed today's episode and want to continue learning and growing with us, don't forget to subscribe, follow, rate, and review our podcast. Your feedback and support mean the world to us. And remember, healing is a lifelong journey, and you have the power to transform your life in profound ways. Stay curious, keep exploring, and never stop believing in your own capacity for healing.
